1935 Packard -- does it have a frame #, and if so where?

Queries about model and year identification, engine and vehicle numbers, etc.
1935Packard
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1935 Packard -- does it have a frame #, and if so where?

Post by 1935Packard » Sun May 20, 2018 11:58 pm

I understand that 11th series cars have frame/chassis serial numbers, but I looked on my 1207 in the place where the 11th series chassis serial numbers are, and I didn't find anything. Does anyone know if 12th series senior cars have chassis numbers, and if so where they are located?

Dave Czirr
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Re: 1935 Packard -- does it have a frame #, and if so where?

Post by Dave Czirr » Mon May 21, 2018 4:56 am

You've got me thinking about it now, but I believe they continued with the frame numbers on the Senior cars thru 1936. If so it's on the side face of the frame rail, driver's side, just above the trunnion block at the rear of the front spring, as shown for 1934 in the factory drawing below. And it is a Frame Serial Number, not a chassis number, your chassis number is 1207.
Attachments
34 number locations.PDF
(2.45 MiB) Downloaded 51 times

1935Packard
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Re: 1935 Packard -- does it have a frame #, and if so where?

Post by 1935Packard » Mon May 21, 2018 2:35 pm

Thanks, Dave! I looked there, and I didn't see anything. Here's what that area looks like on my car:
IMG_7943.JPG
Sorry for the reflection where you might expect the number to be; I used some extra-fine steel wool to clean off the surface rust to see better, so it's a bit shiny there. No sign of any serial number, though. I believe my car is all original underneath, as well, with the exception of new front leaf springs put on about 5 years ago. My grandfather bought the car in 1942, and he never touched anything down there. You can still see original paint and the like.

In contrast, here's a picture from this forum of the number from an 11th Series car:
Screen Shot 2018-05-21 at 3.23.19 PM.png
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Perhaps they no longer used frame serial numbers by the 12th series, or at least by the end of the 12th series? Mine is a later car, near the end of the 12th series run (#47 of a believed 52 or 53 12th series coupe-roadsters built), with date etchings of the remaining original glass saying May and June 1935.

Dave Czirr
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Re: 1935 Packard -- does it have a frame #, and if so where?

Post by Dave Czirr » Mon May 21, 2018 3:09 pm

I'm quite familiar with the number locations of an 11th series, I've owned one for the past 54 years.

Perhaps I was in error about the number continuing on into the 12th series; I've got some friends with 12th series seniors and I'm going to ask them to check their frames.

1935Packard
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Re: 1935 Packard -- does it have a frame #, and if so where?

Post by 1935Packard » Mon May 21, 2018 3:25 pm

Thanks, Dave! I appreciate it.

Also, I didn't mean to suggest that you didn't know where the numbers are on your car -- I just figured others might be interested in seeing the difference. I've greatly enjoyed your writing about your '34, and I've always been super-impressed both at your knowledge of Packards and your tremendous generosity sharing your expertise with others. Thanks for all that you do for us in the Packard hobby.

Dave Czirr
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Re: 1935 Packard -- does it have a frame #, and if so where?

Post by Dave Czirr » Mon May 21, 2018 4:43 pm

Just spoke to a friend in Texas with 3 12th Series seniors. No frame number that he knows of, including in the area above the trunnion block.

It's a dull day in the Packard world that you don't learn something new!

1935Packard
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Re: 1935 Packard -- does it have a frame #, and if so where?

Post by 1935Packard » Mon May 21, 2018 8:07 pm

Really interesting -- thanks, Dave, for checking.

Dave Czirr
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Re: 1935 Packard -- does it have a frame #, and if so where?

Post by Dave Czirr » Tue May 22, 2018 1:13 pm

CORRECTING PREVIOUS POST!

I just had a call from my friend in Texas; after seeing the photo here he more thoroughly cleaned the spot of two frames of 1935 seniors and sure enough there are 6-digit frame numbers with a star at each end, *38XXXX*.

1935Packard
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Re: 1935 Packard -- does it have a frame #, and if so where?

Post by 1935Packard » Tue May 22, 2018 9:17 pm

Thanks, Dave!

For what it's worth, I took a closer look, trying to clean away 83 years of grime. The only writing I see in that area so far is an "A" marked in the center of the space over the trunnion block:
IMG_7949.JPG
IMG_7951.JPG

1935Packard
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Re: 1935 Packard -- does it have a frame #, and if so where?

Post by 1935Packard » Sun Sep 30, 2018 8:42 pm

I think the frame serial number question for 12th series senior cars may have been solved. I was at a show today that featured six 12th or 14th series senior cars, a mix of Super 8s and 12s, and I checked their frame numbers. The results were pretty interesting. All of the 8s and Super 8s had frame numbers in the expected location. However, the two 12s did not have frame numbers there. Instead, they had what my 12 has: Just the letter A in the frame right above the trunion block.

Here are the pictures of two of the 8s/Super 8s:
IMG_9033.jpg
IMG_9037.jpg
Here's a picture of one of the 12s (you have to look closely to see the "A," but you can just barely make it out):
IMG_9039.jpg
I contacted 12th series 12 expert Dave Mitchell, and asked him where the frame serial numbers are on the 1207 and 1208s. He responded that he didn't think the '35 12s had frame serial numbers at all. They were on the earlier cars, and the 8s/Super 8s in '35, but in '35 they were not put on the 12s. So it seems that the answer to my original question is that it depends on which 1935 Packard senior car you're asking about. The 8/Super 8 have frame serial numbers in the usual location, and the 12s don't. Or so I can tell so far.

Why the 12s would not receive the same serial numbers as the 8s and super 8s -- something that according to Dave was also true of other serial numbers, like the steering box -- is not entirely clear. Maybe they were just lower volume? But either way, thought some (or at least Dave Czirr!) might find this of interest.

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