UK - Based 1941 110 Touring Sedan Deluxe RHD

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analyse999
Posts: 208
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:02 am
Location: Yorkshire, England (UK)

Re: UK - Based 1941 110 Touring Sedan Deluxe RHD

Post by analyse999 » Sat Oct 27, 2018 8:15 am

STILL STRUGGLING WITH STEERING COLUMN

I simply can't find a way to remove the sliding pin that goes through the column and the detent (see pics). it seems to be a single shaft that funs through the detent, but with a different and larger section in the middle, which runs through a slot in the column. Pushing the detent into the second selector exposes the end of the slot in the column, but nothing appears that suggests how the pin can be removed to free the detent lever. Can anybody help me with advice on this, as it's now held me up for a month ?

Many thanks in anticipation.
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analyse999
Posts: 208
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:02 am
Location: Yorkshire, England (UK)

Re: UK - Based 1941 110 Touring Sedan Deluxe RHD

Post by analyse999 » Tue Nov 20, 2018 4:47 am

STEERING COLUMN - UPDATE

Having surprisingly had no responses to my multiple please for 'help' through the forum, generally a guaranteed source of information, I gave up and took the column to a local engineer who is older than god. He had a 'fiddle', and solved the problem in 10 minutes.

The pin that holds the Detent Selector in place on the sector shaft is in fact chamfered, so one end is bigger than the other. After figuring out which was the 'wider' end, the pin, which appears to be a friction fit in the detent, was carefully drifted out, and hey presto, the whole unit could be disassembled at last.

In fact this pin passes right through the outer shaft (the one with the slot in), and also through the inner shaft which connects to the gear selector on the steering column. The inner shaft moves up and down when the column selector is moved, and thus slides up and down through the slot in the outer shaft. Meanwhile the detent is prevented from rotating on the outer shaft by the slides, so that it moves up and down thanks to the inner shaft movement, and thus the detent moves into the recess of one or the other selector arm, and so engages the selector arm. Then, in either of those positions, the whole shaft assembly rotates to operate the selection of one or other of the two gears controlled by that selector arm, again by moving the column selector). So; I know understand how it operates, and how to disassemble it.

On inspecting the original selector arms, as well as some bending, the inner cutout where the detent fit into each was worn, which would allow some free movement of the detent in this slot, and thus contribute to 'slop' in the mechanism. The new selector arms (of course with no wear) are a much better fit, both in terms of their main mounting to the shaft, and with a much closer fit to the detent. They are certainly 'beefier' than the originals, and the hole for the selector linkage is just enough for the linkage without any bushing (unlike the originals), but in technical terms they seem to be a big improvement, with less 'slop' in any direction of motion.

So; next job it to reassemble the column (packing the detent with plenty of graphite grease), repair and refit it, then I can steer the car again.

Once that's done, its off to my friendly expert for us to replace the front King Pin Assemblies and Wheel Bearings, and start making a list of the other mechanical jobs.

Slow, but progress at last to making my old girl roadworthy and reliable. Happy Days.
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analyse999
Posts: 208
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:02 am
Location: Yorkshire, England (UK)

Re: UK - Based 1941 110 Touring Sedan Deluxe RHD

Post by analyse999 » Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:36 pm

KINGPIN REPLACEMENTS

My Garage 'guy' has finally managed to get a slot for my 110 to get onto his lift to start some much-needed mechanical refurbishment.

First Job is to fit new front kingpin and wheel bearings to help dial-out some of the front end slack in the steering. I already have excellent kin-pin 'kits imported and ready, so we set to and quickly stripped the two hubs. The 'kits have a roller bearing and a ream-able bush to mount the upper and lower ends of the new pin in the stub axle, as per the helpful instructions from forum members.

However, when we stripped the hubs on the car, on both sides the upper AND lower pin carriers fitted were roller bearings - i.e. no bushes ???

Our presumption is this was a service 'modification 'by a previous owner -not an issue in itself, but it creates a problem for us in that we now can't tell from the car which way round the new parts fit into the stub axle, i.e. bearing to the top and bush to the bottom, or vice versa. Can anyone tell us ??

Many thanks in anticipation
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analyse999
Posts: 208
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:02 am
Location: Yorkshire, England (UK)

Re: UK - Based 1941 110 Touring Sedan Deluxe RHD

Post by analyse999 » Fri Feb 15, 2019 4:17 pm

SLOPPY STEERING ISSUES

Having decided on an assembly sequence for the kingpins (-Thanks to Dave - see Suspension Forum for details), it was time to move onto another element of the sloppy steering, the steering arms/linkages themselves.

The spring box has no discernible play, which was great news, but dropping the Steering connecting rod exposed a cracked Rod Ball Seat Spring (that holds the rod tight onto the corresponding knuckle) -a new now was prompt ordered from Max Merritt, but that certainly would not help with tight steering.

A second problem was getting the whole steering assembly out of the car, as the bolt that fastens the steering crank into the centre of the front crossmembers,ember had seized in its spacer, an issue as it needs to be extracted downwards but the upper end of the bolt protruded through the upper crossmember plate under the engines nose, precluding any drifting force (hammer) to its top. The solution was to drill through the bolt head and centre from underneath, then tap a thread into the hole, finally run a second bolt into the threaded hole which was welded to a slide hammer -a few careful downward strikes and it all came free, without destroying the bolt. With the steering arms etc out, after cleaning in the parts washer the good news was there was no discernible movement in any of the joints, suggesting these had been replaced at some time. However, the Bush and 'Top 'Hat' spacers for the mounting bolt had some play, so a kit of these new parts is now on order from Max Merritt. The real surprise though was the state of the crossmember where the bolt came through a lower and upper plate. This bolt sits in nothing more than a simple hole drilled in each plate; no bushing, no reinforcement. Over the years the bolt had worn both these holes into ovals, allowing lateral movement of the bolt in this mounting point which of course should be static.

To repair this, the bolt is fitted with a thick washer on the outside of the lower plate, so this will simply be welded to the lower plate to provide a fixed round mounting hole; a piece of thick steel plate will be cut and drilled then welded on the outside of the upper plate to offer the same at the top. That and the new bush/bolt kit & spring together with the new kingpins and wheel bearings should hopefully take out the worst of the steering 'slo', and then it will be a case of any some point renewing the rest of the front bushes, maybe new radial tyres, all of which can be done when I get new front springs and rebuilt shock absorbers. All good fun !
Last edited by analyse999 on Fri Feb 15, 2019 4:23 pm, edited 2 times in total.

analyse999
Posts: 208
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:02 am
Location: Yorkshire, England (UK)

Re: UK - Based 1941 110 Touring Sedan Deluxe RHD

Post by analyse999 » Fri Feb 15, 2019 4:22 pm

REAR SUSPENSION QUERY

As part of inspecting my cars underside to identify and plan remedial 'mechanical refurbishment', I couldn't help notice these rear axle springs with internal 'airbags'. I cant see these in my Parts book, so wonder if they are genuine Packard parts or 'aftermarket. At present they are not pressurised.

Has anyone any knowledge of these, and if so, how they are meant to work ??
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Rear 'Air Bag' and spring

Dave Czirr
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Re: UK - Based 1941 110 Touring Sedan Deluxe RHD

Post by Dave Czirr » Fri Feb 15, 2019 4:24 pm

Aftermarket!! Sometimes added if the owner wants to carry exceptionally heavy loads, or perhaps thinks his rear springs have weakened. With proper rear springs certainly not needed nor even desired.

analyse999
Posts: 208
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:02 am
Location: Yorkshire, England (UK)

Re: UK - Based 1941 110 Touring Sedan Deluxe RHD

Post by analyse999 » Fri Feb 15, 2019 6:29 pm

Thanks Dave - as always you are the man.

Two Questions;

1). how do they fill, what pressure etc. ??

2). Would you leave them on just as a talking point, or remove & revert to original ?

Dave Czirr
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Re: UK - Based 1941 110 Touring Sedan Deluxe RHD

Post by Dave Czirr » Sat Feb 16, 2019 5:32 am

1. Don't know.

2. If they were actually serving some useful purpose like compensating for weak or broken springs, I'd leave them in place until I was prepared to service the suspension. Otherwise I'd remove them.

A 3rd reason occurred to me that someone might have installed them and that would be to compensate for the tongue weight when towing a trailer. Any evidence that car had a trailer hitch?

Howard56
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Joined: Mon Dec 24, 2012 11:35 am

Re: UK - Based 1941 110 Touring Sedan Deluxe RHD

Post by Howard56 » Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:30 am

On the question of how they fill, those appear to have an ordinary Schrader valve inlet and would fill with the same setup used for tires. Minimum pressure would need to be something to keep the bag from deflating and able to get caught between the spring coils if there was a large amount of compression -- 5 psi was mentioned on some sites. Maximum pressure would depend on the manufacturer and what was specified. For the workable range needed to level the car, that would depend on the load up to the maximum psi the bag can handle. For something as old as those bags may be, their condition may have deteriorated significantly -- if they can even still hold a decent amount of air.

Here is a link to a site with recommendations for modern bags but those numbers could vary considerably on yours due to age or the composition of the material used in construction. https://www.truckspring.com/blog/post/2 ... y-air-bags
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analyse999
Posts: 208
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:02 am
Location: Yorkshire, England (UK)

Re: UK - Based 1941 110 Touring Sedan Deluxe RHD

Post by analyse999 » Sun Feb 17, 2019 12:35 pm

Great responses, guys; thanks.

No the car never had any towing hitch that I can see evidence of, so as you say it might just have been to supplement the suspension (I believe this car was exported to South Africa from new...).

Re. condition, yes they may well be deteriorated - I might try inflating them just to see, but if they don't work or I cant find replacement bags (great link- thanks) I will remove them when I renew the rear shocks/bushes and have the springs re-tempered. Interesting parts though.

Have a great weekend, and thanks again.

Howard.

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