R9 thrust washer spring

Discussions related to engines, transmissions, rear axles, suspension & steering.
Post Reply
User avatar
Kirtie
Posts: 166
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2015 11:49 am
Location: Moorhead, MN USA
Contact:

R9 thrust washer spring

Post by Kirtie » Sat Oct 20, 2018 1:45 pm

My thrust washer has suffered catastrophic failure, and thankfully I’ve located a replacement. However, I’m also in need of the spring washer that provides the tension for it, and simply cannot find one ANYWHERE.
3.277 / 371251

I’m wondering if there’s enough information about it to find a generic replacement? I have no idea what kind of force it needs to provide, and I failed utterly to measure it (or any of the other small bits) when I had the overdrive apart several years ago.

Any (constructive ;) ) thoughts or advice?
********** KIRT LIEDAHL **********

1949 Packard 2272 Super Eight Touring Sedan ("Pearl")
http://facebook.com/pearlthepackard/

Howard56
Posts: 1121
Joined: Mon Dec 24, 2012 11:35 am

Re: R9 thrust washer spring

Post by Howard56 » Mon Oct 22, 2018 7:00 am

Kirt, I don't have any specs to offer any thing definite but from the photo on page 15 in the Econodrive training manual it looks like it might be an ordinary wave washer to provide just a bit of tension to the thrust washer. Possibly Herm the Overdrive Guy would have some answers or maybe a spring. If not, and there is enough left to measure thickness of the original to get an approximate strength I would think a Belleville disc or Wave disc spring from McMaster-Carr or MSC would substitute.

User avatar
Kirtie
Posts: 166
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2015 11:49 am
Location: Moorhead, MN USA
Contact:

Re: R9 thrust washer spring

Post by Kirtie » Mon Oct 22, 2018 5:03 pm

Thank you, Howard!

I think MM has found one for me, that’s where I located the replacement brass thrust washer.

Here’s a question: In order for reverse to work, I needed to manually lock out the overdrive with the knob under the dash. Is that simply because the linkage was out of adjustment?

I lost reverse when the brass washer remnants prevented the lockout process from working (I couldn’t pull the handle out).
********** KIRT LIEDAHL **********

1949 Packard 2272 Super Eight Touring Sedan ("Pearl")
http://facebook.com/pearlthepackard/

Howard56
Posts: 1121
Joined: Mon Dec 24, 2012 11:35 am

Re: R9 thrust washer spring

Post by Howard56 » Mon Oct 22, 2018 5:59 pm

This might explain the no reverse. Possibly the thrust washer spring broke and a piece prevents the lockout collar from moving or something else has jammed it.

The reverse operated lockout rod pushes against a spring which in turn pushes to move what needs to be a fairly free moving collar. It doesn't take much to keep the collar from moving so might be cable adjustment. Could be the lockout lever not being all the way in position is keeping the collar from freely moving with only the spring pushing. If you want to check, as I recall when knob is out the lever end is forward at about 5:00 and just a tiny bit away from the stop. When knob is in, the lever end is about 8:00 and a fair bit away from the stop which is at about 9:00. Since the cable is moving the lever which is directly linked to the collar could be it will move enough when the knob is pulled. In some cases cold or thick gummy oil has also provided enough resistance the collar didn't want to move. Since your oil is fresh and probably not the issue it might be the thrust spring did other damage or perhaps something else was bent when the spring broke.
Attachments
reverse.jpg

User avatar
Kirtie
Posts: 166
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2015 11:49 am
Location: Moorhead, MN USA
Contact:

Re: R9 thrust washer spring

Post by Kirtie » Tue Oct 23, 2018 7:07 pm

Hi Howard:

I’ve made a couple of discoveries. First, it’s the thrust washer that sits adjacent to the free wheel cam that disintegrated, not the one next to the spring washer. I am embarrassed to say I simply missed them while I was taking stock of everything.

So it’s 3.276 / 347607 I’m missing.

In the Packard Literature, this washer is described as steel, yet mine was brass, and the ones I’ve seen available (MM) are also brass. Perhaps it doesn’t matter.

I believe I’ve also discovered the culprit in this whole scenario. The bolt on the end of the main shaft has a notched washer on it. This notch is designed to fit into a spline groove on the main shaft, presumably to hold it in place. The washer had cupped, the notch did not fit (or stay at any rate) into the groove and the bolt thusly “unscrewed”, leaving the entire assembly free to rattle around in there.

I ran a tap and die on the bolt and into the threads on the main shaft to clean them up, and straightened the notched washer in the vise. I will be much more careful to see that the washer is correctly notched in the spline groove.

Fortunately, I’ve found almost no damage to the gears, cogs, or splines on anything in the overdrive. I took the free wheel cam apart, cleaned it with brake cleaner and analyzed every piece of it and the rollers- all seem to be okay. I’ve thoroughly cleaned out the case, and I’m HOPING that with the arrival of the replacement washer I can reassemble the unit with confidence.

I believe you were right- a piece of the washer was preventing the action of the lockout collar, which prevented me from reversing (thank heavens- who knows when I’d have ever taken a look otherwise?)

Finally, while I was under the car, I moved the shift fork into reverse and saw the plunger pop back, as designed. It traveled approximately 1/2 to 3/4 inch. This should be enough, just by eyeballing the lockout plunger, to lockout the overdrive. I’m curious why it never did. I always had to lock it out manually before I could reverse- without doing so, the car would not move (though you could hear gears whirring).
********** KIRT LIEDAHL **********

1949 Packard 2272 Super Eight Touring Sedan ("Pearl")
http://facebook.com/pearlthepackard/

Post Reply